Hi Vk3Jed,
On <Mon, 29 Mar 20>, you wrote me:

Another possibility is fudging it on the server side by setting the lastread pointer to the last message that was fully downloaded, when
using NNTP. Someone raised that possibility the other day. The add
in would simply have to retrieve the value of the lastread pointer and update TB on opening the group.

Yes.. I saw that. I understand it better the way you just said it.

..It's not like one is flooded with messages
these days anyway. ;)

You'll be surprised, especially on nets like FSXnet, which has been
known to get 100+ messages in a day in its main echo. :)

I was a little surprised to see so few echo areas in FSXnet after I heard it was one of the busiest FTN based message echange. It seems to primarily cater to bbs sysops/techie. That's fine. But the _GEN echo tends to get many different topics. Imho, it could be better to expand the area collection to more topics. The _GEN echo could then serve as a welcome base where people can be steered into the other areas that match a query/topic.

This is the fundamental problem I see with the defacto Fidonet. First, there is no easy way for a newcomer to identify a "dead" echo. That just adds frustration when posting in an echo that many people have abandoned. Instead, if there was a WELCOME, ENTERHERE, GROUNDZERO echo for example, that would be the fist echo the visitor could post their interest and the experts could steer the visitor to an appropriate echo for that topic. That process would help keep the plethora of other echo areas populated. This mechanism could serve well for the othernets too.

And it's even worse when you lost track and end up replying to an old message you had already replied to! :D

In my foray into revisiting QWK/Sempoint, I've encountered the same issue especially when fetching the same echo from diffferent BBSes (to explore which one I like better). But then, that is where threading (on the case of Sempoint - the "parent/child" symbol and the msg number next to it)comes in handy.

I've moved to OpenXP (and operating as a point) for FSX_GEN. The threading and message management is feature rich. For example, while reading one message of interest pressing Shift-# produces a thread-tree:

References of "testing qwk.."
2732 21.03 +-Vk3jed Re: testing qwk..
+ 1774 21.03 +-Ogg
2385 21.03 Ý +-Vk3jed
+ 1328 24.03 Ý +-Ogg
582 25.03 Ý +-Oli
516 25.03 Ý Ý +-Phoobar
1137 25.03 Ý Ý +-Phoobar
1030 25.03 Ý Ý +-Al
1280 25.03 Ý Ý Ý +-Phoobar
546 25.03 Ý Ý Ý +-Al
642 25.03 Ý Ý Ý Ý +-Phoobar
17k 25.03 Ý Ý Ý Ý Ý +-Al
580 25.03 Ý Ý Ý Ý Ý +-Phoobar
459 26.03 Ý Ý Ý Ý +-Vk3jed
485 26.03 Ý Ý Ý +-Vk3jed
863 26.03 Ý Ý Ý +-Phoobar
+ 356 26.03 Ý Ý Ý +-Ogg
w 733 26.03 Ý Ý Ý Ý +-Phoobar
w 1537 26.03 Ý Ý Ý Ý Ý +-Al
1536 27.03 Ý Ý Ý Ý Ý +-Oli OS/2 tossers
2511 27.03 Ý Ý Ý Ý Ý Ý +-Al
1201 27.03 Ý Ý Ý Ý Ý Ý +-Oli
631 27.03 Ý Ý Ý Ý Ý Ý +-Phoobar
1485 27.03 Ý Ý Ý Ý Ý +-Phoobar
w 435 27.03 Ý Ý Ý Ý +-Spectre
879 27.03 Ý Ý Ý +-Vk3jed
w 1220 27.03 Ý Ý Ý +-Phoobar
1518 28.03 Ý Ý Ý +-Vk3jed
858 28.03 Ý Ý Ý +-Phoobar
726 28.03 Ý Ý Ý +-Vk3jed
946 28.03 Ý Ý Ý +-Phoobar

1124 29.03 Ý Ý Ý +-Vk3jed
1179 29.03 Ý Ý Ý +-Phoobar

1603 26.03 Ý Ý +-Oli
711 26.03 Ý Ý +-Phoobar

The "+" messages are the ones I want to keep (will not be purged). "w" are messages I am thinking of replying to. And the ">" are messages in the thread that I haven't read yet.

While viewing the thread-tree, the built-in help (F1) produces a fine reminder of the various options. Here's a sample view:

^--------------------------------------------------------^
| E Finds, if possible, the first message |
| containing the "Subject" of the current |
| message. If more than one match is found, all |
| matches will be marked. |
| |
| R Reply publically to a message. |
| This would normally be used when replying to |
| either newsgroup or echomail posts. The |
| subject of the current message and the |
| reference link will be preserved but the |
| original message text will not be quoted in |
| the reply. This is more commonly referred to |
| as "Reply without quote". If it exists, the |
| Head message template will be automatically |
| inserted. |
| |
| Ctrl-R Same as "R" above but the text of the |
| current message will be quoted. This is more |
| commonly known as "Quote-Replying". If it |
| exists, the PublicQuote message template |
| will be automatically inserted. |
| |
| Shift-B If you mark several messages, this will |
| quote all of them. Be very careful with this | v--------------------------------------------------------v

How many devices to you "hop" for FTN-based mail anyway?

I have it down to two, because I have the netbook for travelling.
Having phone access would be nice, but hasn't proven practical for me
at this stage.

I don't see nntp/newsreader a practical solution for a smartphone. Too awkward to edit a good looking reply using a tiny virtual keyboard. But it could be a good tool to monitor activiy or spot a personal reply in advance.


..Regards,
August

* SeM. 2.26 * Was Beehtoven's 1st movement done in the toilet or privy?

---
þ Synchronet þ Palantir BBS * palantirbbs.ddns.net * Pensacola, FL

On 03-29-20 09:32, August Abolins wrote to Vk3Jed <=-

Yes.. I saw that. I understand it better the way you just said it.

:)

I was a little surprised to see so few echo areas in FSXnet after I
heard it was one of the busiest FTN based message echange. It seems to primarily cater to bbs sysops/techie. That's fine. But the _GEN echo tends to get many different topics. Imho, it could be better to expand the area collection to more topics. The _GEN echo could then serve as
a welcome base where people can be steered into the other areas that
match a query/topic.

That's done deliberately, and the reason for the activity is likely the limited number of echos. The alternative is a Fidonet style "wasteland" of dead echos, as discussion is spread out too thin.

This is the fundamental problem I see with the defacto Fidonet. First, there is no easy way for a newcomer to identify a "dead" echo. That
just adds frustration when posting in an echo that many people have abandoned. Instead, if there was a WELCOME, ENTERHERE, GROUNDZERO echo
for example, that would be the fist echo the visitor could post their interest and the experts could steer the visitor to an appropriate echo for that topic. That process would help keep the plethora of other
echo areas populated. This mechanism could serve well for the
othernets too.

That assumes people will move on. They often don't for a whole host of
easons.

And it's even worse when you lost track and end up replying to an old message you had already replied to! :D

In my foray into revisiting QWK/Sempoint, I've encountered the same
issue especially when fetching the same echo from diffferent BBSes (to explore which one I like better). But then, that is where threading
(on the case of Sempoint - the "parent/child" symbol and the msg number next to it)comes in handy.

Yep, same issue, effectively.

I've moved to OpenXP (and operating as a point) for FSX_GEN. The threading and message management is feature rich. For example, while reading one message of interest pressing Shift-# produces a
thread-tree:

I'm not going down the point road, because again for me, it has issues similar to NNTP, in that last read pointers are now kept on the point system. If I made the point accessible over telnet/FTP, sure, it might work, but then I might as well just use the BBS. ;)

And I don't see the point (pardon the pun) of running something like HotDogEd on my phone, it's the wrong model for a mobile device, in my book. An offline reader would make more sense for that platform.

I don't see nntp/newsreader a practical solution for a smartphone. Too awkward to edit a good looking reply using a tiny virtual keyboard.
But it could be a good tool to monitor activiy or spot a personal reply
in advance.

Could be useful for quick replies.


... This MSG written by pouring warm tea on an Ouija board.
--- MultiMail/Win v0.51
þ Synchronet þ Freeway BBS, Bendigo Australia. freeway.apana.org.au